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Dealing with stigma against real artists using AI as a tool for social media.
I got a beef with this dude (the Synthwave FB group admin), and it isn't just about the Christian faith ban in his Synthwave FB group. Oh, no. He's banned all AI sharing, too. And that's perfectly fine. People have the right to allow or disallow anything they want in their own group. I have a blog, a website, and a Facebook group to post what I wish, and that's more fun than trying to navigate someone else's many rules. Ugh! It can't get any more exhausting than trying to keep up with all these rules in these groups.
It's time to address the beef with certain admins in FB groups who frown upon AI art sharing. Posting images related to your passion shouldn't be a crime, especially when it sparks conversation and connects like-minded individuals.
The complaint of AI goes like this:
((The Generative AI ban- I'll jump right into it. We are once again having to reiterate that this small corner of your internet experience is one that we try to make genuine, welcoming and fair, one that is for the moment, free of a.i.))
Telling an artist what they can or cannot post on FB concerning AI or the lack thereof may result in many people moving on from your group or page. Just prepare yourself to understand that. Realize that technology is advancing, and things are changing as they always have since we were young. And older gens criticized our music style and told us 'It takes no talent'. What did we do? We kept making more of it. It is a good thing we never threw our vision away due to criticism from classic rock artists or fans.
All the while, we have a Synthwave group promoting electronic music from the 80s while hating on AI. Oh, the irony! Good luck with your AI ban.
((You might ask "why are you doing this to me?" The short answer is ethics.))
Ethics as in, having your own images created rather than taking someone else's images and posting them on you Facebook page or website without permission or credits? Which one is more ethical? You even state on your FB rules:
Don't like people sharing images made by other artists or producers without credit? No problem. We can have our own images created via AI or our own artwork, legally! Problem solved, right? So what could possibly go wrong? Everything! And, oh boy; its a big deal!
How AI Generates Images
((The datasets used to power your ai image generators are fundamentally built on ethically dubious legal loopholes. Laion 5B (the most widely used dataset) was compiled by a German research company called Laion, (a company owned by Stability Ai) and the images were collected by another non-profit called common crawl, who collected around 5 billion images from around the internet to train its dataset.))
For any art medium, references are needed to create art, and to make realistic art more accurate. If you are a true artist, you would know that images are needed to gain ideas and inspiration. So, are you supposing that AI should somehow be different? Is your supposition that is should somehow generate images from nothing? We don't even do that with traditional art.
The purpose of compiling the Laion 5B dataset was likely multifaceted, but one of the primary objectives was indeed to use the dataset for training AI models, particularly those focused on image generation or related tasks. By gathering a large volume of images from the internet, the dataset provides a diverse and extensive collection of visual data that can be utilized to train AI algorithms to understand and generate images in various styles, contexts, and categories.
Some potential purposes and applications of the Laion 5B dataset for AI image generation include:
Training Generative Models: The dataset can be used to train generative models such as Generative Adversarial Networks (GANs) or Variational Autoencoders (VAEs) to generate realistic and diverse images. These models learn to mimic the patterns and structures present in the training data, allowing them to generate new images that resemble those in the dataset.
Image Synthesis and Manipulation: Researchers and developers can use the dataset to create AI systems capable of synthesizing or manipulating images. This includes tasks such as image completion, style transfer, and image-to-image translation, where the AI generates new images based on the visual characteristics of the training data.
Content Creation and Design: The dataset can serve as a valuable resource for AI-driven content creation and design applications. This includes generating artwork, graphics, or visual elements for various purposes such as advertising, marketing, or entertainment.
Research and Development: The dataset provides researchers and developers with a rich source of visual data for studying and advancing techniques in computer vision, image processing, and AI-driven creativity. It enables experimentation and innovation in the field of AI image generation.
Overall, while the specific goals and applications may vary, the primary purpose of compiling the Laion 5B dataset was likely to facilitate research and development in AI image generation and related areas by providing a large-scale, diverse collection of images for training and experimentation.
The unethical reasons for the hard AI ban!
((These 5 billion images were taken without credit, consent or compensation, while using a loophole in copyright law that allows entities to compile any data they need for "training purposes" not to be sold as a product for profit. The original intent of this loophole was to empower teachers, job trainers and mentors etc. to be able to convey vital information to PEOPLE who may need to learn something specific. Laion did something very different with this data, they trained a product to learn these things and then sold this product in a for profit system. This is the start of the problem. To be clear, YOU would not be able to take these images in the laion 5b dataset and use them as your album art, post them on your personal blog, or use them in a music video, without being open to legal consequences.))
Legal consequences? That would be true if we were actually using the exact images that were used for the reference for AI. But we aren't using those exact images, are we?
The purpose for Laion 5B using those images were for reference. Not for re-using in posts on social media. So, all of those images generated are based on the model training taken from the photos.
As I mentioned, these models learn to mimic the patterns and structures present in the training data, allowing them to generate new images that resemble those in the dataset
This is why we shouldn't punish artists or content creators for posting AI generated images on their social media platforms or blogs. Personally, I only use AI images for social media posts such as Twitter, FB, and Instagram, and sometimes website decor: the very purpose AI images are made for.
((These companies being organized as "non profits" are afforded privileged legal exemptions, and won't be found guilty of collecting and using otherwise copyrighted data. The issue is that these companies collecting data under these exemptions, are now funneling that same data into for profit commercial ventures like SD, all funded by Stability AI. So this supposedly for research, non profit, legally privileged dataset is being used by a for profit company (currently valued at over a billion dollars) as the secret sauce in their flagship product. They are also selling this secret sauce to other companies for profit. This is the main problem we have with the current state of generative ai and why we eventually landed on the hard ban.))
A blanket ban on AI would stifle innovation and legitimate research efforts in artificial intelligence. Instead, we should address underlying issues like data misuse through clearer regulations and ethical guidelines. Efforts should focus on promoting responsible AI development, educating about ethical considerations, and fostering collaboration.
Regarding legalities, honesty is key: artists should credit AI-generated work as such and only claim credit for their own creations. Banning AI art based on a few companies' actions restricts artistic freedom for all.
Adapting to new technology can be challenging for those who are set in their ways.
((There were of course other things we considered, but this is the one we universally agreed upon. You can @ me all you want and argue this, it won't change until either the companies change their tune, or regulation comes into play. The popular objections you're gonna throw at me are as follows.))
Just ban everything is not the answer. Promoting responsible use is! Rather than banning AI art outright, there should be a focus on promoting responsible and ethical use of AI technologies. This could include educating artists and developers about proper data usage, consent, and copyright laws, as well as encouraging transparency and accountability in AI development and deployment.
(("Everybody said the same thing about synthesizers in the 80s (or you'd use some other historical false equivalencies to farm equipment or printing presses)" yes, they did, BUT the synthesizer is its own thing, it could have been invented independently from any musical compositions, it didn't REQUIRE Michael Jacksons entire discography to be taken without consent, compensation or credit for someone to pick up a synthesizer and play Billie Jean. The same can't be said of sam yang and stable diffusion.))
This sounds like the people who like classic rock while dissing electronic music because they don't believe music can come from a computer, or that only music that can be played with real instruments can be considered "real". And the previous generation before that claimed that "Rock Music was of the devil". Now we've got AI and people who hate artwork generation because its "not real art" or taken from real references, as if old art wasn't also taken from real references. And as we know, classic rock fans and EDM fans have their opinions about what real music is, talent, and how music is supposed to be executed. And, in reference to AI; so do you.
(("It's here you can't stop it, adapt or die" to an extent, nobody disagrees with you in base concept. That said, just because it's here, doesn't make it right, and if anything, most people are just asking for ethical implementation not outright extinction of the tech.))
You sound like those in previous generations who had a hard time adapting to new technology. Well... welcome to the new technology, bruh! I see you're having a rough time of it.
You have no reason to hate it besides the fact that it is new. Even if you don't like it, you don't have to be like your grandparent's generation saying that "EDM takes no talent" and that it's not "real music".
Is punishing the wrong parties really the answer? Banning AI art as a response to the actions of specific companies would punish artists and creators who have no involvement in those actions. It's unfair to penalize a whole community of artists for the misconduct of a few corporations.
((You're using AI because you don't care about your work!)) What??
(("I can't afford an artist, you're only hurting us little guys" this one I have little to say about, basement producers did just fine for a very long time before this tech came out. I don't buy into the idea that all of a sudden it's impossible to do without.))
Yeah, tough luck for artist like me who wish to grow on social media platforms by making at least one post a day, but don't have the time to sit around and doodle all day, right? Traditional art is time consuming. It is worth it. But its also not good for one post a day due to production time limits. Some of us have full-time jobs and have bills to pay. It's a real dilemma.
((Also, when we did allow it, how much engagement were your posts getting? I'll tell you, because we kept a very close eye on this, you got none.))
Are you trying to speak for me? Because I have gotten a lot of engagement! I've grown by a long shot by posting consistently about the music medium, and the culture surrounding my music. Even if it was by the use of AI images. Imagine that!
And sure, we can all do without AI. I have for 40 years. However, AI art represents an innovative and rapidly evolving field that has the potential to push the boundaries of creativity and technology. Banning AI art would stifle innovation and hinder the progress of this emerging artistic medium.
((All of your album arts looked the same. They gave the impression you cared about your own work so little, that you couldn't be bothered to put genuine effort into its presentation, so why should people care enough to engage with your work.))
No skin off my nose if you don't like my Retro 1980s neon lit AI art on my FB page, which has gained a lot of traction btw. You can't please everyone.
Also look at the facts. You won't gain much of a following if you're not making enough art because you don't have enough time on your workdays to do it. People will criticize you for posting other people's images (even with credits because people hate on those who stand for something). People will criticize you for posting AI images. Or anything! The list goes on.
If you read my story: "Rumors are carried my haters, spread by fools, and accepted by idiots" I illustrate my bad experiences with people coming to my pages and threatening legal actions over shared posts, all because of a conflict of interest. They threatened to sue me and made threats against me. All because I stated something on Twitter they didn't like. You can read more details about it there. So, after dealing with that mess; I was delighted when this AI art technology came out. Now I can finally share the things I truly want to, legally; without that type of stigma. And I'm sure these same people who criticize AI would applaud that. But then they want to spit on AI art, too. I would rather post AI content then to face lawsuits over FB posts, wouldn't you?
((All our album arts look the same?)) Sounds like a shoddy pretext to me. Not everyone is a graphic artist. And that's ok. Hire an artist or train an AI image generator. Good grief.
I think my album art looks beautiful. All created by me, of course. Not some AI generator. What is with people, these days? The stigma against AI now comes down to hating on art produced by the artists themselves.
I can only imagine some trolls coming under my hard work screaming:
((Too many AI generated bs in Synthwave groups!")).
Oh boy. This is getting out of hand! I could imagine being banned from groups for that accusation. I see it coming. But for posts on blogs and discussion on social media? Looks like I'm out of the picture.
And again, there is nothing wrong with using AI as a tool for social media. But remember, never claim a piece of art as your own if you did not create it yourself. Can we at least agree on that?
If a REAL artist, such as myself; who writes and performs her own music can use AI for FB posts to engage and grow, why dump on it?
Especially seeing how it can be used to help you grow. By harboring this idea in your head that this is somehow taking away from real artists? Who have used this as a benefactor for them? How is my social media posts taking from YOU in any way???
(("It's just a tool, it requires craft and care, etc" to give you the benefit of the doubt, I'll say there's an argument to be made that in their current state gen ai can be used as a tool, it won't stay that way for long, you really think "prompcraft" is still gonna be a "thing" 3 years from now? I doubt it.))
If it isn't a thing in the next 3 years, I guarantee it will be something else that you'll find reason to complain about. If you don't want to accept the fact that AI is the future, you're going to be very disappointed. Just like classic rock fans were when EDM became a thing. And here we are in 2024, making EDM! How sacrilegious of us!
((AI is going to replace real artists?)) What??
((They are not marketed as tools for artists, they are marketed as replacements for the very people used to power the tool. Here's some excerpts from stability AI's statement for researchers, just read some of this language. "Stable diffusion is a text to image model that will empower billions of people to create stunning art within seconds"))
-Jordan Noir
Congratulations! You've finally made a real argument against AI. And I see how slick you were to slip this in, even after your long ramble about ethics. You're claiming that the people, who created the images that help power AI; will be replaced by AI. It is everyone's fear it seems. AI is taking over everything, music, art, creative writing, video games, advertising. You name it. This is why I believe in the approach of: "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em". Learn to use it to your advantage. If you don't learn to navigate today's world, you will inevitably be overwhelmed by it in the future. And that is what I am seeing now. In the future, we may have to navigate the world in a very different way than we did in the past. That is the reality of it. The world is ever changing. And if we are unwilling to adapt to the changes, we will be left behind.
While concerns about AI potentially replacing human creativity are valid, there are numerous ways in which artists can leverage AI to their advantage to enhance their creativity, productivity, and success. Here are several ways AI can benefit artists:
Augmented Creativity: AI tools can serve as creative aids, helping artists generate new ideas, explore different styles, and experiment with techniques they may not have considered otherwise. By collaborating with AI, artists can augment their creativity and push the boundaries of their artistic expression.
Workflow Optimization: AI-powered tools can streamline various aspects of the creative process, from ideation to production. Tasks such as image editing, color correction, and composition analysis can be automated using AI algorithms, allowing artists to focus more on the conceptualization and artistic aspects of their work.
Personalized Feedback and Critique: AI systems can analyze artwork and provide personalized feedback and critique based on factors such as composition, color theory, and artistic style. This feedback can help artists identify areas for improvement and refine their skills over time.
Content Creation and Curation: AI-driven content creation tools can assist artists in generating digital assets, such as backgrounds, textures, and patterns, for use in their artwork. Additionally, AI-powered content curation platforms can help artists discover and explore a wide range of artistic inspirations and references.
Audience Engagement and Marketing: AI technologies can be used to analyze audience preferences and behavior, allowing artists to tailor their artwork and marketing strategies to better resonate with their target audience. AI-driven recommendation systems can also help artists reach new audiences and expand their fan base.
Monetization Opportunities: AI-driven platforms and marketplaces offer artists new opportunities to monetize their artwork, such as licensing digital assets, selling prints, or offering personalized commissions. Additionally, AI-powered algorithms can help artists optimize pricing strategies and maximize revenue from their creative endeavors.
Cross-Disciplinary Collaboration: AI facilitates collaboration between artists and technologists, leading to the development of innovative projects that merge art and technology. By leveraging AI expertise from interdisciplinary teams, artists can explore new mediums, techniques, and creative possibilities.
Overall, while AI presents challenges and uncertainties for the future of creativity, it also offers tremendous opportunities for artists to enhance their craft, reach broader audiences, and achieve greater success in their artistic pursuits. By embracing AI as a tool for empowerment and innovation, artists can harness its potential to thrive in the ever-evolving landscape of art and technology.
As I stated before, technology is wonderful, but it does have its limits.
Claiming AI-generated art as one's own creation on social media can be misleading and deceptive to others. It creates a false impression of artistic ability or originality that may not accurately reflect the individual's skills or contributions. This can lead to a loss of trust and credibility within the creative community, your brand, and among followers.
However, AI can serve as a benefactor for artists who create their own work and serve as an assistant to help them grow their audience.
But what about AI generated images? Sharing AI-generated images on social media platforms can spark conversations and engagement within online communities. It provides a platform for individuals to discuss the intersection of art and technology, share insights, and exchange ideas about the potential impact of AI on creative industries and society as a whole.
AI is not about original art, but to share content.
(("You can see some of the amazing output that has been created by this model, without pre or post processing on this page". Notice how they do not want you to have to do anything with your output, they don't want to leave anything for you to do, artistry, creativity and craft have no place in generative a.i. and this is by the design of the very people who create and sell it.))
Some people sell AI art. I don't. Social media is the place to share it. Nothing wrong with that. AI-generated images often possess unique and visually compelling qualities that can captivate and inspire viewers. Posting these images on social media provides an opportunity for individuals to explore and appreciate new forms of artistic expression that may not be achievable through traditional means. It fosters creativity and experimentation in digital artistry.
AI cannot take away creativity and craft; instead, it has the potential to enhance and amplify these qualities in various ways. Here are several reasons against the idea that AI diminishes creativity and craft:
AI as a Tool, Not a Replacement: AI is a tool that augments human capabilities rather than replacing them. It can assist artists in generating ideas, exploring new techniques, and streamlining workflows, but it does not possess the intrinsic creativity and intuition that humans bring to the artistic process.
Unlimited Possibilities for Exploration: AI opens up new possibilities for artistic exploration by enabling artists to experiment with algorithms, data, and computational methods in their creative practice. This allows for innovative approaches and unconventional expressions that would not be possible through traditional means alone.
Collaborative Opportunities: AI fosters collaboration between humans and machines, leading to synergistic partnerships that combine the strengths of both. Artists can collaborate with AI systems to co-create artworks, develop new tools, and explore novel artistic mediums, leading to richer and more diverse creative outcomes.
Empowerment Through Accessible Tools: AI democratizes access to creative tools and resources by providing affordable and user-friendly software platforms that artists of all backgrounds can utilize. This empowers individuals to express themselves artistically, regardless of their technical expertise or traditional training.
AI as a Source of Inspiration: AI-generated art can serve as a source of inspiration and exploration for human artists, sparking new ideas, pushing creative boundaries, and challenging conventional notions of artistry. By engaging with AI-generated content, artists can expand their artistic horizons and incorporate novel techniques into their practice.
Preservation and Innovation: AI can contribute to the preservation and revitalization of traditional crafts and artistic traditions by providing new tools for documentation, restoration, and reinterpretation. Additionally, AI-driven innovation in materials science, fabrication techniques, and digital media opens up new avenues for creative expression and experimentation.
In short, AI doesn't stifle creativity; it opens up new avenues for artistic exploration and collaboration. Artists can use AI as a tool to expand their creativity and push boundaries.
However, it's important to remember that AI isn't a replacement for genuine artistic expression. It can assist in generating ideas and references, but the actual creation still requires human input.
Just like artists use reference images, AI utilizes them too. Banning AI art based on this would restrict artistic freedom.
((You use AI? You're banned from our group!)) What?
(("You're just a luddite who's scared, you should be embracing this stuff" this one is utterly ridiculous. To call me and the other mods Luddites shows just how out of touch you are with this scene and the people behind it, many of us have been incredibly active and doing anything we can to innovate and push synthwave further. We LOVE technology, many of us were incredibly excited by gen ai and it's possible applications, despite the negative implications of what could happen. Personally I was one of the first people shouting about gen ai (specifically midjourney) from the rooftops about how awesome it is and the things it can do.))
Great! So why hate on AI posts then? And punish the posters?
((It wasn't until we started to learn about the datasets many of us got a bit more leery about the concept. To be clear, I'm double upset because I would love to use gen ai as an iterative tool in my concepting stage of my workflow, when I was using it, I felt a euphoric rush of endorphins with the instant gratification of pushing a button and seeing something vaguely related to my idea shot out at me, which I could then take parts of and incorporate into my work, in SO disappointed the whole thing is built on a foundation of mud, making the whole house worthless.))
So, it's not really about the "lack of creativity" but the databases? We already covered that.
Stopping AI art because of worries about data and who owns ideas would be really bad for artists and making new things. We should focus on fixing those problems instead of banning the art.
((Bottom line, if you want to post here, don't use ai. The same will apply to video and audio content. We endeavour to make this a space that continues to celebrate the people who make the stuff we love. If you feel the need to use ai, that's fine, that's your decision, and there are plenty of other places that will welcome that content.))
And I will be glad to post elsewhere, mainly on my own page; the things I wish to post. No hard feelings. I just don't happen to agree that banning all AI is the answer to any unethical problem corporations have done. That has nothing to do with me. Address the corporations, not the posters or music artists.
Also, generating AI art is not the same as creating it yourself. We at least agree on that. But AI art can be used to engage an audience on social media which is a perfectly valid way to grow an audience.
((And nothing of value was lost.))
If you guys aren't fostering unity within your group, then I will go where I am valued. Because when you cast your pearls before swine, nothing good ever comes from it, does it? It's as I always say:
"Knowing your worth means you don't have to convince anyone else of it!"
I am not doing Synthwave how you think I should do it. I am doing Synthwave how I, as an individual artist; sees fit to do it. And if that makes me look out of place to you, then so what? My aim is to reach people with the gospel message and make incredible Dreamwave soundscapes. And if you don't like my style, that's ok! But to diss other artists who make different decisions than you? That's dishonorable to me. Looks like I may have to create my own community of people who are fed up with being told how they should or shouldn't do their music. Join me at Neon Dreams Collective on FB which welcomes all different types of Synthwave works and image sharing! No sweat!
Using visuals to showcase your niche and spark creativity is a powerful tool. And let's not forget those who threaten legal action over shared content – talk about killing the vibe! Let's foster a community of support and inspiration, where creativity thrives without fear.
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